ZipitForge - Trac

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I know this is talking out my backside here but would be great if we could get like pocket IE5 on these. I used to browse the net very easily on My Dash with no mouse or touch screen, just hitting the arrow pad down would skim the page down to the next link

[00:03:56]

ogmious09: if there was wine for wince

[00:05:36]

jagsph: what's the links option for changing to mobile pages using the user agent?

[00:05:51]

I know people hate on CE or Windows Mobile 5.0 and up but it made my Dash very useful, I still miss that phone

[00:07:10]

need to unbrick my .29 zipit so i can try this stuff :)

[00:07:48]

Jagsph, you seen LXLauncher?

[00:08:02]

we need stella on the zipit now :)

[00:08:05]

-fake-user-agent "Mozilla/4.0 (compatible; MSIE 4.01; Windows CE; Smartphone; 176x220)"

[00:08:35]

jagsph: thnx -- only works from the command line? not in the config?

[00:08:51]

rkdavis: should work in the config. ive never done it though :)

[00:08:59]

k

[00:09:07]

ok beed time for me

[00:09:10]

ogmious09: lxlauncher? for lxde?

[00:09:23]

LXLauncher

[00:09:43]

I mean it's part of lxde but specifically the LXLauncher

[00:10:03]

Ive seen it. yeh....

[00:10:48]

Its pretty cool. I almost thought about using it. But nobody has used rox-filer in a project for a while.

[00:11:22]

Yeah I almost wonder if that would be a better way to go with these things, almost don't need the mouse

[00:11:54]

Not knocking what you have done, I mean you're pre-release is pretty darn cool, just thinking

[00:12:21]

I had it running on my zipit and it was working fairly well

[00:12:30]

I dunno. Well you can bind a shortcut key to anything on the desktop of rox-filer... and you can navigate through it without using the mouse.

[00:13:46]

Im willing to try it. But the integration with the file manager is what sold me on it. Not to mention the shortcut keys and how I can navigate as much or as little as I want without using the mouse. But in all honesty I havent tried lxlauncher

[00:14:18]

matchbox also has a launcher i was thinking about looking at... its just such a toss up...

[00:14:26]

Well you've seen the screenshots I am sure, so seeing those you get the general idea

[00:14:47]

im running debian i can install lxlauncher right now.

[00:15:24]

I know it would be hard or atleast difficult time wise to get this thing as less dependent on the mouse as possible, it's just so tedious trying to pinpoint with it

[00:15:48]

and it would take someone with a heck of a lot more Linux know how than me

[00:16:17]

right off hand i installed lxlauncher just now. its not automatically navigating with the keyboard

[00:17:00]

mouse working on it?

[00:17:32]

I had the mouse emu launching from a script in cli before I would start the wm when goofind around

[00:17:43]

if I turned the mouse off it would navigate with the arrow keys

[00:17:59]

yeh... its on my desktop... i want to be able to integrate something closely with the keyboard

[00:18:28]

especially for the Z2. like a lot of people might want to make a shortcut key to the Applications .... so they dont need to use the mouse... at least i do

[00:19:25]

it appears to not allow for the use of a background image...

[00:19:42]

if you used matchbox-desktop it's fully keybind friendly :)

[00:20:03]

the only thing I can akin it to is like my old T-Mobile Dash, did everything on it all arrow keys, no mouse no touch screen

[00:20:14]

wicknix: then you lose the wallpaper ability...

[00:20:26]

office, internet, pdf, watching movies, etc

[00:20:32]

jagsph, nope, not really. just not easily set.

[00:20:44]

just have to edit a config by hand to change walpaper

[00:21:12]

matchbox-desktop has a wallpaper ? its just a ton of icons on a gray screen.....

[00:21:21]

:)

[00:21:55]

wicknix: I could just start a rox filemanager window, put the desktop icons in there, remove the window border and it would be the same thing as this

[00:21:57]

jagsph, my userland with matchbox on the jornada 720 : http://www.hostwork.com/users/matt/j720/

[00:22:15]

that looks good.

[00:22:19]

thanks

[00:23:26]

thats fully navigable via keyboard huh?

[00:23:38]

yes sir

[00:24:19]

i installed it on my desktop. how do you select an icon on the desktop

[00:24:38]

I see in your screenshots that you have a few selected.

[00:24:56]

its been awhile since i soley used it. tab key?

[00:25:01]

and arrow keys

[00:25:04]

i think

[00:25:17]

alt+m opens the panel menu

[00:25:22]

just switching menus..

[00:25:37]

hit return/enter

[00:25:45]

i only opened the matchbox-desktop. i have xfce running

[00:26:05]

ahh, might be intergated with mb-panel and mb-wm

[00:26:25]

with all 3 running keybindings work for sure

[00:26:26]

weird. i cant get it to select anything but changing the current visible menu on matchbox-desktop

[00:27:01]

check /etc/matchbox or ~/.matchbox for the keybinding config

[00:27:05]

edit at will

[00:27:34]

what do you think wicknix: stick with rox or try out matchbox?

[00:27:45]

i like them both honestly

[00:27:50]

both have their uses

[00:28:28]

matchbix was intended for embedded use though and fits the screen of the z2 well

[00:28:42]

worth experimenting with

[00:28:54]

wicknix: i liked the default behavior of matchbox-window-manager, which is what i used... and i liked rox-filers explorer like integration

[00:29:06]

like i said, with your userland i added mb-panal right away to get a nice 'start menu'

[00:29:28]

you can still start rox-filer as just a file manager also

[00:29:37]

with no pinboard/desktop

[00:29:38]

wicknix: the only reason i did not add that was the screen space confinement... even then i would have used lxpanel.

[00:29:55]

That's pretty slick wicknix

[00:30:11]

pretty slick

[00:30:36]

:)

[00:31:00]

jagsph, yea i hear ya, but a wifi signal util, clock and menu are handy

[00:31:05]

you two should go into business together, designing some pretty slick looking ui's

[00:31:09]

for the 'average user'

[00:31:30]

wicknix: true, its going to be a tough decision .... maybe an auto-hide on the taskbar?

[00:32:04]

jagsph, i dont think matchbox allows that, it might and i just missed it playing with switches

[00:32:15]

you seriously got firefox running on one of those?

[00:32:21]

i know icewm does and jwm does autohide nicely

[00:32:23]

wicknix: lxpanel does allow that... their taskbar...

[00:32:50]

ogmious09, yep easily on the 728 (64mb ram) and it was ok on a 720 with a swapfile

[00:33:04]

as it only had 32mb of ram

[00:33:26]

yeah I use to have a jornada

[00:33:56]

jagsph, yeah lxpanel would be ok too. lots to choose from. i chose jwm and rox-filer for my mips userland

[00:34:07]

http://www.taitaonline.co.uk/3MX/images/3MX-Ultra-desktop.png

[00:34:33]

that is slick too.

[00:34:37]

not that i needed jwm to autohide on a 800x480 screen.. heh

[00:34:44]

couldn't port that to the zipit wicknix

[00:34:54]

320x240 screen is a joke

[00:34:55]

but its light, very light

[00:35:19]

wicknix: i might hide the window title bar and just have people use ctrl+esc to manage the tasks

[00:35:29]

ogmious09, thought about similar actually. just make the desktop look like 3MX, and plop it an OE userland

[00:36:03]

whatever i can do to maximize space. im like 2 pixels off on a lot of things from having parts cut off

[00:36:07]

see between the two of you. If you melded, that would be the perfect ui for this zipit for the average user

[00:36:14]

jagsph, could yea... or try a different matchbox theme. a few are thinner in the border department

[00:36:21]

brb girlfriend needs attention

[00:36:27]

heh

[00:36:40]

wicknix: i will look into a few. spent too much time getting things to run right.

[00:36:48]

i know the feeling

[00:36:50]

heh

[00:36:52]

If he's anything like me, he'll be back in a minute takes me 2-3 minutes 4 tops

[00:37:00]

lol

[00:38:44]

man, how did I miss that jornada image. I was looking everywhere for something just like that a year ago

[00:40:26]

i started that 2 years prior to joining jlime, then abondned it, made mongo, then updated that old 2.4 kernel userland to bring it up to speed

[00:40:47]

as 2.4 kernel had sound, while 2.6 didnt/doesnt (yet)

[00:41:01]

and i liked streaming radio and using mplayer for movies

[00:41:26]

then lost interest in the jornada.. heh

[00:42:05]

then got a mobile pro 900c, made jlime henchman, then the 900c it smoked itself

[00:42:18]

poor lcd ribbon design

[00:42:28]

bridged on the mobo and poof

[00:42:43]

you two need to be on payroll, especially since these ports are the grandfathers to whow we will be using the net primarily in the future

[00:43:22]

that whow is supposed to be a *how. Not sure how the extra w worked it's way in

[00:43:52]

nobody would pay me..lol. i know nothing really. no schooling, cant even get a crappy ISP job, even though i can run circles around their own techs. :(

[00:44:12]

no school = no hire

[00:44:18]

Dude, i got em no emudcacion either.

[00:44:30]

i just do these as a hobby. its more fun that way.

[00:44:32]

And I have worked in engineering departments

[00:44:41]

and no pressure

[00:45:07]

Got a small but pretty successful electronics repair shop. So don't let that education phooey stop yeah

[00:45:50]

it doesnt, im happy with my current job anyway. been there a few years. make decent cash. cant complain.

[00:46:19]

See we used to call it a computer repair shop that dabbled in tv and console repair. But my employees thought it'd sound fancier f we went with electronics repair, lol

[00:46:28]

and fixing family and friends computers pays for beer and smokes..lol

[00:46:50]

all works out in the end

[00:47:18]

Well as long as you keep contributing to the UI, I am happy too

[00:47:34]

makes hardware guys like me look like we know something booting up a slick looking ui

[00:47:39]

what else did i do... hmm... ohhh yeah... before all this, was QNX RTOS. I ported boatloads of *nix software to that.

[00:47:53]

Man I remember QNX.

[00:48:02]

Major hype over that when it first came out

[00:48:08]

i loved QNX

[00:48:16]

its actually been around about 35 years

[00:48:25]

QNX Nuetrino

[00:48:54]

it got mainstream atention when they released that bootbale floppy disk with a gui , web browser, etc etc

[00:49:01]

Yeah but wasn't something like 7-8 years ago, they came out with a boot floppy?

[00:49:11]

beat me to it

[00:49:15]

heh

[00:49:37]

I was farting around with BeOS at the time

[00:49:45]

QNX is used in places youd never notice... street light controllers, hosptial equipment, etc etc

[00:49:58]

yeah i played with it too, but never really liked it

[00:50:04]

beos that is

[00:50:27]

I was blown away with how my ati tv card worked right after boot perfectly. No other OS was doing that at the time

[00:50:33]

it was like some weird form of unix meets mac meets windows

[00:50:46]

not like that's a measurement or anything but it was neat

[00:51:06]

heh yea

[00:51:17]

booted quick too for its time

[00:51:44]

I akinned it to NEXT

[00:52:06]

well yeah, the UI they kind of ripped of from next and amiga

[00:52:10]

of/off

[00:55:46]

the girl is puttying on something seductive. and no i take 5 minutes.

[00:55:56]

:) brb again

[00:55:58]

hah

[00:57:09]

Guy must be some kind of friggin machine

[00:57:30]

Like a Sex terminator from the future

[00:57:44]

viagra :)

[00:58:06]

Who needs Nuke Power Cells when you got Viagra

[00:58:22]

its the only way one can last 5 minutes!

[00:58:38]

Inhuman

[00:59:06]

lucky if she gets 5 minutes over the course of a week

[00:59:13]

heh

[00:59:30]

It's a race, won. Finish quietly, I am trying to sleep over here

[01:48:41]

wicknix: can we come to an accord on the ui style that would be most suitable for the device?

[01:50:23]

jagsph, 320x240 is so tiny... i like how you have it honestly.

[01:50:35]

i myself just prefer a taskbar

[01:51:52]

matchbox-wm is probably the best wm in the fact that it auto scales everything to fit the screen

[01:52:11]

i hated fluxbox etc where i had to manually maximize every window

[01:52:14]

to make it fit

[01:55:55]

wicknix: i heard openbox you can configure it per window. in a .conf

[01:56:12]

wicknix: also i was thinking about cutting out the taskbar but that might be too much for a regular user.

[01:56:17]

taskbar=titlebar

[01:56:26]

yeah, there is also a way to make icewm maximize every window also

[01:56:39]

with autohide taskbar

[01:56:41]

:)

[01:57:37]

and icewm also has a nice alt+f11 (or remap it) which fullscreens any window and removes all window borders and taskbar

[01:57:51]

wicknix: taskbar adds overhead

[01:58:01]

with a nice alt+tab window switcher

[01:58:20]

true, but thats what swap is for :)

[01:59:16]

there are so many options available, the hard part is seeing what fits this machine best

[01:59:34]

i cant get the window switcher working in matchbox :(

[02:00:16]

prob because the default keybinding is thrown off by the zipits odd keymap

[02:00:36]

it uses alt+p or alt+n to cycle windows

[02:00:41]

i tried changing to a few different keybindings but it still doesnt take it

[02:00:48]

but on the zipit that changes the keys

[02:01:35]

prob have to replace the alt+p with ctrl+p etc etc

[02:02:14]

right now its set to ctrl+W which does nothing when pressed

[02:02:28]

### Window operation short cuts

[02:02:28]

<ctrl>w=next

[02:02:28]

<ctrl>p=prev

[02:02:43]

is that with z2mouse enabled or disabled?

[02:02:56]

as i lose half my keys when its enabled

[02:03:01]

both

[02:03:05]

hmm

[02:03:15]

maybe its not reading the config from the right location

[02:03:29]

/etc/matchbox/kbdconfig

[02:03:40]

there should be 2. one in /etc/matchbox, the other in ~/matchbox

[02:04:07]

edit the one in /home/user/

[02:04:19]

i see there is one in there that i didnt create.

[02:04:29]

thats what it will read

[02:06:23]

cool that did it. it was being over-ridden by the faulty ones in there

[02:07:21]

well kind of.

[02:07:22]

good deal

[02:07:35]

the show desktop works... but the Alt+tab feature doesnt

[02:08:16]

prob due to the wacky keymap

[02:17:27]

wicknix: should i compile synk4.c on the Z2 and market it as a WIFI terrorist device?

[02:17:45]

hah

[02:18:37]

i could script in a broadcast spoofer and an arp poisoning device to go along with it

[02:19:13]

im sure it'd do quite well too.

[02:19:41]

funny thing is it probably would handle it rather well...but in all reality nmapfe might be neat to include

[02:20:39]

include icenuke.c option in lostirc

[02:21:13]

tag it as "Shut up" in the drop down menu when you select a user in the list

[02:21:24]

or aircrack-ng and kismet

[02:21:34]

heh

[02:21:36]

not supported on the chip :)

[02:21:42]

ahhh bummer

[02:21:56]

thats what i was told anyway

[02:22:43]

ok where is the binary for snes9x i cant compile it. ive given up.

[02:23:35]

inside aliosa27's oe+x11+mouse userland

[02:23:56]

maybe my dcc will work tonight, let me try quick before u dig for that

[02:24:16]

ok. will save me a few mount commands

[02:25:05]

i should let you know im in a rather odd network situation...

[02:25:22]

me too

[02:25:31]

dcc is hit or miss for me

[02:25:34]

im behind a router, which is routing to a wireless network, which is being bridge by my router which is running dd-wrt

[02:25:49]

better yet i'll upload it to my webhost quick

[02:25:53]

2 nats.

[02:27:18]

http://www.hostwork.com/users/matt/zipitz2/snes9x

[02:29:12]

nice... thanks any others things i should attempt to bitbake?

[02:30:12]

depends how in depth you want to get. Midori web browser can scale webpages and is webkit based. :)

[02:30:38]

That would probably rape the swap file and take ages to load

[02:30:54]

runs great on a 206mhz jornada with 32 meg ram

[02:31:17]

just dont open any tabs :)

[02:31:24]

without swap anyway

[02:31:45]

i run firefox on that hardware

[02:31:54]

and it isnt really slow wither

[02:32:06]

either*

[02:32:08]

you have got to be insane to run firefox

[02:32:12]

epiphany barely runs

[02:32:44]

i havent tried on the zipit. in theory should be faster on the zipit

[02:32:46]

and that other one with the f'd up name kazakaze

[02:33:00]

but jornada prob has better internal hardware

[02:33:06]

i wasnt impressed. i tried it. very slow

[02:33:17]

tried gpe-mini-browser?

[02:33:33]

nice and light interface

[02:33:36]

same backend

[02:33:44]

no is it better than links2 ?

[02:33:59]

webkit backend, so yea

[02:34:01]

heh

[02:34:15]

but very light UI with fullscreen ability

[02:35:09]

perfect PDA browser (thats what it was intended for)

[02:35:34]

*bitbake gpe-mini-browser* i didnt even see if it existed first

[02:36:33]

here we go. task 270 out of 1852

[02:37:37]

sweet. i means links2 is nice and handles the basics well, but a better rendering, fullscreened browser would be kick ass

[02:38:15]

im down for that

[02:38:32]

but then again, its a zipit, cant have it all..lol

[02:38:44]

debian is really lacking on embedded and lightweight applications

[02:39:19]

big time. debian isnt meant for embedded devices, the compiles are generic with no optimizations either

[02:39:31]

thats why OE userlands are much quicker

[02:39:56]

smaller binaries, optimized gcc options, less dependancies

[02:40:04]

sounds like gentoo

[02:41:19]

the deps thing with debian kills me... install xchat and you also get python, perl and tcl.. on an OE userland you install xchat, and get only xchat :)

[02:41:45]

i told rkdavis earlier, if you want a fully functional desktop just apt-get install pidgin

[02:41:47]

thats a 40 meg difference in download and userspace size

[02:43:02]

its just sort of a f in the a when there is no repo built

[02:43:21]

another idea... build centerim, its a nice console multi messenger thats easier to use than finch

[02:43:35]

sure there is... angstrom

[02:43:43]

i have a 64bit sempron 3100...can u imagine what a bitbake wolrd would do

[02:44:03]

add the angstrom armv5te to aliosa's OE userland and away you go :)

[02:44:13]

armv5te feed urls*

[02:44:45]

that was i *was* using.. heh

[02:44:54]

i ipkg installed all kinds of crap

[02:45:39]

if the packages are available i can move the system without much trouble. right now im working with debian since i know debian =\

[02:45:58]

ive been using for too long

[02:46:22]

nothing wrong with that.

[02:46:37]

its where the desktop is headed anyway with ubuntu.

[02:47:09]

the speed difference is quite noticable on slower systems like these though.

[02:47:24]

between debian and and OE build userland

[02:47:57]

alot of the packages arent built for angstrom

[02:47:58]

god i cant type anymore..lol. it is almost 2am... i should have been sleeping 2 hours ago.. heh

[02:48:11]

no, but they can be

[02:48:20]

angstrom is lazy is all

[02:48:44]

and making a custom .bb for oe is easy for anything not included in OE

[02:49:10]

i submitted a good 10 or .b files i made when i was at jlime

[02:49:26]

centerim, naim, frobtads to name a few

[02:49:31]

wicknix: how about the openpandora project ? where are their binarys

[02:49:48]

good question

[02:50:06]

ive seen forums with talk about them using OE. but they must have a repo for all of that.

[02:50:28]

im sure they do, *somewhere*

[02:50:56]

these projects need to merge into 1, sort of like debian without massive overhead

[02:51:40]

some could i guess, but the thing with OE built distros is they are made for sooo many different machines and arches

[02:51:55]

different bootloaders, kernels, kernel modules etc

[02:52:07]

it'd get messy

[02:52:29]

at least keep a repo of the baked packages such as snes

[02:52:54]

yeah, thatd be nice

[02:53:24]

#openpandora is on this network. i might hop in there tomorrow and ask if they have a binary repo heh

[02:53:41]

alright dude, i really have to hit the sack or i'll be a bag of shit at work.

[02:53:59]

k dude. later. enjoy the 2 hours of sleep

[02:54:07]

4, but close..lol

[02:54:23]

*poof*

[02:55:11]

http://neuvoo.org/neuvoo/packages/armv7a/

[07:38:59]

how do you turn off the keyboard leds

[07:39:18]

echo 0 > /sys/class/backlight/pwm-backlight.1/brightness

[07:40:07]

thanks

[07:50:06]

whats the difference between notepad and text editor?

[07:51:54]

one was faster, opened in the terminal...

[07:52:18]

the menu is controlled by the :) <-- escape key on notepad

[08:02:36]

http://www.thecodingstudio.com/opensource/linux/screenshots/index.php?linux_distribution_sm=Hannah%20Montana%20v1 LOL

[08:13:43]

morning all

[08:21:57]

hi. http://openpandora.wordpress.com/2009/08/18/the-pandora-gui-what-it-was-is-and-will-be/#more-1873

[08:22:21]

this video shows the pandora looking a lot like what i set up. minus the matchbox-desktop

[08:24:32]

rkdavis: i want to see a pandora binary repo. so i can steal their binarys :)

[08:26:33]

jagsph: don't use the term steal what you mean is you wish to borrow for testing purposes

[08:28:56]

rkdavis: of course. borrow them so as to not waste cpu cycles compiling in OE

[08:29:18]

morning

[08:32:21]

rkdavis: gp2x is armel isnt it? im going to see if i can launch their binarys on the Z2 http://dl.openhandhelds.org/cgi-bin/gp2x.cgi?0,0,0,0,5

[08:33:30]

jagsph: not got the foggiest either arm or mips

[08:33:43]

the dingoo is mips so the pandora prolly is arm

[08:34:05]

pandora uses the ti omap. so pandora is arm

[08:35:03]

jagsph: although everything is bigger i think i prefer links without the faked mobile user agent, but it's handy to know anyway

[08:35:29]

yup ti omap is arm7 core iirc though

[08:35:37]

so alot of stff might not work

[08:36:05]

we are arm4 and parts of arm5 a sort of arm4.5

[08:36:45]

that is of course if they use non-generic LCD arm optimisations

[08:37:44]

they have gl capabilities, so that will probably stop anything that wont run in software or fb mode. if the code executes on this processor

[08:38:25]

i just tried something for the gp2x. its just segfaulting

[08:38:27]

yup no hardware accelleration on the zipit

[08:38:59]

jagsph http://zipit.pastebin.com/f428d1b9f

[08:40:20]

I knew i posted that stuff someplace

[08:40:38]

hah. Yeh I just posted the same thing....

[08:40:49]

http://zipit.pastebin.com/f7ced388b

[08:41:14]

heh im quite sure yours is better =)

[08:41:49]

not really, it just shows selection. If you tested the network configuration script im going to build it into something like that

[08:42:05]

one other thing though is to disable onboard speaker. [its on even if volume is 0] thats about 20-30 min of power right there

[08:42:12]

the way it works is it lists files in a directory such as /control/applets and executes the file name as a script...

[08:42:29]

with my settings i have gotten close to 6 hours ot of the zipit battery

[08:42:32]

i didnt see the onboard speaker in /sys right off hand

[08:42:49]

Is it still on if you unload the sound modules?

[08:42:54]

yea i always had to go in with alsamixer. though im sure theres a way to do it as a script

[08:43:33]

and i was tol kb illumination of 1 is the actual off point. [0 for some reason is not]

[08:43:53]

Oh... if you mute the speaker in the mixer it saves battery?

[08:44:01]

yes

[08:44:35]

the speaker is worthless anyway. thats going on mute by default then.

[08:45:30]

its fairly worthless. by playing with alsamixer i have gotten it listenable. but headphones are better.

[08:46:00]

I have only been able to hear one channel out of it

[08:47:00]

i have done it in the past. but it has been a while

[08:47:21]

there must be another control that i am missing

[08:47:52]

yehthere is alsa mixer shows a few others

[08:48:19]

it has literally over 10 controls in alsamixer

[08:49:06]

yes and one of the gain ones is important i think

[08:49:20]

i should have writen down my settings

[08:50:04]

Headphone / PCM / Speaker

[08:50:17]

Arrows adjust the setting and m toggles various setting on and off.

[08:50:23]

im looking at my old faq

[08:50:24]

heh

[08:51:07]

fceu nes emulator runs under X use string ./fceu opengl 0 sound 0 xscale 1 yscale 1 romname.zip

[08:51:13]

heh theres something sun

[08:51:16]

fun

[08:51:57]

yeh thats what i got too

[08:52:16]

fceu -nofs 1 -frameskip 3 -sound 1 -soundrate 48000 -soundq 0 -soundbufsize 52 -opengl 0 -fs 0 -stretchx 1 -special 0 -stretchy 1 doublebuf 1 -fs 0 -xscale 1 -yscale 1 -xres 320 -yres 240 -input1 gamepad -inputcfg gamepad1 "$@"

[08:52:35]

hehe

[08:53:14]

without -frameskip 3 its horrible

[08:53:45]

i couldnt not get it to stretch to the size of the screen

[08:54:28]

i dont think i had a problem there.. but then i didnt play with it much

[08:54:46]

it will only cover 2/3 of the screen

[08:56:41]

ill have to try it again sometime

[08:56:49]

oh wow i got the sound very loud

[08:57:07]

i think it blew my headphones

[08:57:23]

uhh yea got a be carefull . the headphone jack amp is insane.

[08:57:41]

i never tried to turn it up that high. its like plugging it into a car amp

[08:58:30]

i have suspected that might be whats supposed to drive the onboard speaker.. but i dontknow

[08:58:48]

Mcavity: it would blow that internal speaker haha. do you know about enabling the volume control on the side?

[08:59:55]

last time i saw someone use it they used them as page up and down buttons

[09:01:09]

they should be remappable as Vol_+ and Vol_- but i can't remember the keymap names for that

[09:01:37]

might be in the standard z2shell keymap

[09:02:00]

oh does your image set the time?

[09:02:06]

but iirc they are set like that in the stock

[09:02:19]

ill put that in my notes...

[09:02:52]

mccavity: i didnt finish the script. but its "set-date-time" from the console. then you have to use hwclock to write it

[09:02:57]

btw has anyone tested the zipit keeping time while off, i was told a few days ago that it should at least until it runs out of juice but i don't recall it ever keeping tie while off

[09:03:35]

it didnt keep time for me when the battery died

[09:04:29]

once the battery is dead.. its dead.

[09:07:29]

time script didnt work

[09:07:42]

need to be root

[09:08:17]

cd /home/user/.bin ; ./set-date-time;

[09:08:21]

i would like it to update the time on connection to the web

[09:08:35]

yup that's what they said but the thing is supposed to keep time at least while the battery has juice, never actually noticed as i've bene using ntp but i was interested if anyone had noticed it or not

[09:09:04]

sudo dosent work?

[09:09:16]

Oxymis: this is what i like to hear.. ill do that..

[09:09:30]

why do you like to hear it?

[09:09:35]

Mcavity op shell

[09:10:01]

0xymiss: feedback like that. i didnt even think of using a timeserver on connect

[09:10:41]

humm im doing something wrong

[09:10:50]

I'll get it later

[09:11:08]

Mccavity: i probably didnt finish it

[09:11:13]

:) pre-release remember...

yep

heheh

so jagsph

what button functions as ctrl? power like usual?

[09:11:42]

prboom! and alpine for mail clinet

[09:11:51]

[...]

[09:12:55]

does ntpdate run as root?

[09:13:13]

i would assume it would have to.

[09:13:39]

Mcavity: just type date 010912592010

[09:14:09]

i just made the script to show the formatting for date in an easy to read format. its was supposed to combine with hwclock but i didnt finish it.

[09:15:01]

0xymis: [...] + :) = task manager [...] + Zipitlogo = volume control

[09:16:06]

great

[09:16:19]

ive got to get used to the keyboardshortcuts again

[09:16:33]

so is ... c close, and ... m maximize?

[09:16:39]

put your own keymap in

[09:16:59]

matchbox-window-manager is always full screen

[09:17:34]

you can set your keyboard shortcuts for matchbox in ~/.matchbox/kbdconfig

[09:18:20]

I was having some issues with the key-bindings because of the keyboard map. If you know a better keymap file ill use it.

[09:18:48]

the keymap is in /etc/keymap.map

[09:19:00]

It is called through ~/.xinitrc

[09:19:17]

jagsph: well what changes do you want?

[09:19:33]

i've got several keymap editing windows open atm

[09:20:50]

i'm trying to cut down on the need to press alt+shirt for alot of chars -- still need it for a few things as too many characters too few keys but can get most stuff on it so only 2 keys need to be presses

[09:21:37]

rkdavis: i havent made a list of changes yet. i would like the simplest keymap available that will allow the job to get done without frustration

[09:21:56]

doesnt everyone?

[09:22:28]

jagsph: i have one that i use as a base but it's missing a few chars atm i can send you that if you want

[09:22:52]

is there a shortcut for show desktop?

[09:22:55]

it matches my pdf in every respect except the purple chars that are currently missing

[09:23:31]

can i have a copy of that pdf

[09:23:44]

ill try it out...

[09:24:08]

0xymis: ctrl+d if not add <ctrl>d=desktop to ~/.matchbox/kbdconfig

[09:25:30]

http://russelldavis.org/ZipitZ2

[09:26:04]

russeldavis any relation to hunderdavis

[09:26:27]

rkdavis any relation to anyone?

[09:26:36]

jagsph: let me know if you need stuff moved around and anything in green is uable (well green and purple although trying to avoid the purple)

[09:26:46]

Oxymis: lots of people but not hunter

[09:26:59]

:)

[09:27:15]

man my irc client keeps changing my nick back

[09:27:23]

jagsph: btw nice write up on hunters site

[09:28:00]

rkdavis: thanks, but i dont know what you are referring to

[09:28:03]

is there a pdf reader for the zipit

[09:28:25]

epdfviewer might work from the apt repo

[09:28:26]

i used xpdf

[09:28:35]

xpdf sounds better... lighter

[09:29:07]

just to playwith it but.. memory can get thrashed

[09:29:14]

jagsph: http://hunterdavis.com/archives/440

[09:29:47]

oh for youtube.

[09:30:08]

jagsph: will your image make full use of a 8 gig class 6 micro sd card?

[09:30:21]

Adnyxo: if you want it to

[09:30:21]

i heard that above 4 gb it loses speed no matter what the class

[09:30:27]

oh gawd i got a cat trying to get so close to me (he's being a bodyheat vampire) he's almost crawling up my butt

[09:30:36]

cause its a microsd in adapter

[09:30:52]

morning GPSFan

[09:30:52]

i dont know how that works. it seems about the same in my 8gb card. i know nothing about classes

[09:31:17]

rkdavis, howdy..

[09:31:30]

so jagsph youre soundman

[09:32:05]

Adnyxo: i was having issues with kernel panics due to alsa being buggy, so i used the nick soundguy :D

[09:32:18]

ah

[09:36:50]

oh i gout sound in scum vm

[09:37:02]

I got sound. second option

[09:37:18]

What did I miss in the config?

[09:38:55]

Mcavity: honestly i put it in there really fast just to demo that it worked

[09:39:34]

i just picked the other sound option

just a sec

music driver = seq

sound and music?

that did it

well i think so i get sound. i can hear them talk.

[09:41:07]

havent realy played

[09:41:39]

i think i need to install a soundfont for music

[09:41:40]

right now im trying to ftp into the zipit..but i dont know the username password

[09:41:53]

its on the site. user:zipitz2

[09:42:17]

you should change the password for user so you dont get pwned on a free wifi

[09:42:39]

ahhh i thought it was zipitz2:debian

[09:42:52]

debian is the root password

[09:43:03]

yea.. its a zipit. i dont realy care that much right now =)

[09:43:40]

oh you have cmus?

[09:44:09]

i tried it on there. it didnt seem to do much good

[09:45:07]

meaning my girlfriend wouldnt be able to use it. so i removed it

[09:45:50]

its farly light and can do streaming.. but.. yea not the easyest thing to use

[09:46:01]

jagsph: if your g/f was my wife you'd have to remove everything form it then :)

[09:46:19]

better hope she doesnt see that :)

[09:46:40]

jagsph: she doesn't know how to use scroll back or logs so i'm safe

[09:46:51]

rkdavis: go compile quakeforge for the z2 before or ill tell her about both of those comments :)

[09:47:07]

before i go and tell her about both*

[09:47:19]

jagsph: not much of a threat as she knows i laugh at her lack of technology skills

[09:47:38]

i even have to open her email for her as she is dense :)

[09:48:07]

she doesnt care to learn. its not fun or exciting for her

[09:48:19]

i refuse to support her computer anymore, i've even put it on a seperate network so she doesn't affect me

[09:48:34]

she just has no talent for learning about technology

[09:48:40]

she just wants it setup so it works

[09:49:07]

and as long as i'm around to do it for her she is just happy to leave it at status quo

[09:49:08]

set her up a system with matchbox-desktop only and 2 applications in /usr/share/applications *email and browser*

[09:49:23]

or just put firefox-bin in .xinitrc and say here

[09:50:19]

i would but she plays games on pogo and a few other places that are not fun in linux, so i gave her firefox, thunderbird and a couple of other apps on a crappy ibm thinkpad t20

[09:50:38]

change the shell to progman.exe so she cant do anything stupid

[09:50:45]

i have to keep it running though as she has kileld it almost. it's drunk so much soda it's diabetic

[09:51:12]

wrap the keyboard in plastic kitchen wrap and say its a special protective layer

[09:52:04]

the best fix for the soda in it i have ever done though was she killed the lcd switch inside -- all horrible and sticky and wouldn't press so i used a can of compressed air to freeze the soda and hit it with a hammer to break the solid soda :)

[09:52:59]

i'd get her a new lappy but she is in love with the little red button for the mose, hates real mice and trackpads so until i find a refurb at a decent price i'll keep reserecting it

[09:53:20]

buy a cracker and some whippets for her. say it will be more fun learning if you inhale these

[09:53:38]

but if she downloads anything i just tell her to reinstall, i've got bored removing viruses

[09:53:58]

give her a guest account?

[09:54:00]

i have a ghost cd that takes about 20 mins to reinstall

[09:54:39]

i stick to my expertise i.e. cooking, chemistry and computers and i'll let her stick to hers

[09:54:52]

works out better that way

[09:54:54]

which is what exactly if you do the cooking also?

[09:55:13]

she earns the money and is real good at hogging the tv remote

[09:55:37]

while you sit here and develop for the z2 for free?

[09:56:05]

jagsph: yes but i do other things too

[09:56:28]

like watch british tv and play with the cat, both very important activities

[09:56:52]

rkdavis: i think those are the most important

[09:57:33]

top gear!

[09:57:42]

rkdavis: well how about you order 10,000 z2's ill develop a userland, you go buy a bunch of cheap 4gb sd;s... and then sell them as a cheap alternative to the pandora

[09:57:42]

of course top gear :)

[09:58:04]

with 40% of profits going my way of course.

[09:58:11]

jagsph: because the OEM agreement has some restrictions that preclude me including certain applications

[09:59:00]

unfortunatly zipitwireless don't want premodded zipits that include im, streaming music, texting.... i.e. anything that is in the stock zipit

[09:59:19]

i cna't stop people from adding that stuff i just can't supply it on the zipit

[10:00:03]

rkdavis: so if you supplied a browser and an mp3/movie player with emulation ability it would be legal. since there is no im or streaming audio

[10:00:04]

otherwise i would say sod it and get foxx to come in on the hardware side of things, you for your distro and setup a real comapny

[10:01:04]

and my distro isnt legal. it includes the wifi firmware

[10:01:06]

jagsph: yes i can supply browser etc. just can't offer anything they do as an immediate out of the box setup

[10:01:26]

jagsph: yes there is that although that can be worked around

[10:01:58]

as part of my agreement is that i have to supply them with mac and serialnumber of each zipit i sell and of course if i am premodding i need to turn it on anyway

[10:02:26]

rkdavis: well. there you go. handheld gaming system.

[10:02:30]

so i just copy the firmware of that zipit and iject it

[10:02:59]

there are still details on my end to sort out and website to setup and bank account to open

[10:03:06]

but lots of possibilities

[10:03:26]

oh and a repository of sourcecode to setup too -- bloody GPL :)

[10:03:31]

rkdavis: it needs more memory and GL

[10:03:57]

let someone else set up the source code. say its debian based just dont include any apt-tools

[10:04:24]

jagsph: yup although for alot of stuff (games) they can be handled using SDL an ddirectfb -- at least for the ones that aren't really snazzy and graphics laden

[10:04:24]

just figured out a great use for my half broken zipit. it can be used for ssh tunneling and its low powered so i can leave it on all the time

[10:04:53]

jagsph: yes i think that might work, i have to look for the loopholes like that inmy agreement

[10:05:35]

rkdavis: would be nice to modify the case and keyboard and just use the hardware if you can get it cheap enough also

[10:05:36]

basically from what was clarified and my lawyer's reading as long as i don't preinstall it it's ok if it exists then ok

[10:06:08]

as then it's the users device and they can do what they want

[10:06:12]

so your other loophole is to provide an install cd that they boot from the computer, and then they install it on the z2 they bought as a package deal

[10:06:30]

jagsph: there is another loophole too

[10:06:39]

well not really but it works

[10:06:52]

i am allowed to sell sd card rootfs without the zipit

[10:07:07]

and that can have anything on it i want as i am not selling the zipit

[10:07:31]

rkdavis: can you include the wifi firmware?

[10:07:35]

so i can sell a zipit and an sd card as two seperate transactions as as long as they are posted seperatly it works too

[10:07:51]

but iof course i want to play by the spirit not only the letter of the agreement

[10:08:18]

if the wifi firmware can be included legally ill sell sdcards once i have a properly functioning distro. i wont even feel bad about it.

[10:08:24]

rkdavis: the wifi firmware is as i said previously sticky

[10:08:45]

on premodded ones yes on sd cards i'd have to include an injector program

[10:08:48]

"sticky" ?

[10:08:57]

gotcha

[10:09:14]

yes sticky as zipit is also limited as per their agreement with marvell

[10:09:33]

they should have just used atheros

[10:09:43]

marvell must have cut them a good deal

[10:10:01]

well this was being designed in 2006 and what was available for the right pricepont at the time?

[10:10:31]

is there someone actively working on a better distro for the zipit?

[10:11:25]

owrflow: zipit.rootnexus.org im working on one you have probably already seen it though

[10:12:05]

rkdavis: the license to marvell is b.s. it wont hurt their business because its already been licensed for use on that z2

[10:12:21]

every z2 that is sold has been licensed and paid for already

[10:13:38]

jagsph: yes in that part you are correct

[10:13:45]

but there are other restrictions

[10:14:15]

jagsph, what WM are you using

[10:14:33]

overflow: matchbox with rox-filer for the desktop

[10:15:09]

overflow: thats a pre-release to show what im working on. it works fine but its not complete

[10:15:31]

rkdavis: i know. its just a little excessive imo. thats all im stating

[10:15:32]

marvell are kinda b******s with restrictions, to get updated firmware they almost make you sign over your first boarn

[10:15:48]

rkdavis: why do they provide it for free online then?

[10:16:06]

free with restrictions

[10:16:30]

is it just released?

[10:16:58]

there is nothing special about the firmware. they must be worried about a company reverse engineering it and reselling clones of their chips

[10:17:06]

overflow: yes

[10:17:35]

overflow: video of it http://hunterdavis.com/archives/440/

[10:17:41]

jagsph: everythig can be got around, just how worth it it is to bend the spirit of the agreement if not the letter, i'm going to play it right to the edge but of course i want to play fair to zipit as well as be fair to myself

[10:17:59]

thats why. couldnt remember any downloads last time i checked the site

[10:18:09]

the easiest and probably the /safest/ way is just to do an injector

[10:18:22]

ok back later. gota run for a bit.

[10:18:48]

rkdavis: if you think there is a market for selling sdcards pre-installed with it with an injector i wouldnt be afraid to do it.

[10:19:00]

it's only one extra stage and not going to take long to perform

[10:19:42]

jagsph: yes i think there might be a market, not a big one but one just the same

[10:20:17]

jagsph, it sure looks promising

[10:20:18]

After im done ill buy 5 or 6 cards at a discount and list them on ebay just to see what kind of response I get.

[10:20:40]

jagsph: there is one teeny problem with sd cards only though

[10:21:00]

that might make it better to do it as a cdrom

[10:21:17]

and they are basically the same rules as sd cards

[10:21:42]

you'll need them to have upgraded kernels

[10:22:00]

that was why i was asking if it could be made to work in stock and framebuffer

[10:23:10]

yeh. i like the idea of a linux distribution that boots a cd to install the proper files on a flash device

[10:25:11]

yup the wifi firmware is an inconvieniance and the live cd method would work. i will have to clarify the wifi firmware situation again ust to make sure that i am reading the situation the way i and my lawyer did

[10:25:45]

could make a rewriting sdcard of course

[10:26:29]

rkdavis: maybe just make it simple, get some bulk arm hardware, some cheap 1gb sd cards. implant the sdcards inside the case for the machines and build a custom oe distro with apt-utils. and market it as a gaming device. sell for 1/4 the price of pandora and leave it completely open for other uses. but sell it as a purpose built handheld gaming device with internet support

[10:26:49]

that contains the autoflasher and an imagefile and a few scripts to copy the firmware to mtdblock2 i.e. /mnt/ffs, flash the kernel then overwrite itself with the rootfs

[10:27:14]

jagsph: and of course always that too :)

[10:27:40]

rkdavis: that could work... ... but my way you get to reap the benefits of your hardware sales too

[10:27:47]

yup

[10:28:09]

what do you think the z2 costs? come on its probably $5-10 cost per unit.

[10:28:13]

actually what i just described would work, not sure how idiot proof it could be made but it'd work

[10:28:40]

jagsph: nope at the $50 they eventually sold tjem for that was the breakeven point for the hardware

[10:28:52]

rememebr these were designed and built in 2006/7

[10:29:20]

which means today the cost of hardware "could" be $10 ? or would they still be around $50

[10:29:25]

by a smaller comapany that didn't have the discounts available

[10:29:52]

jagsph: they are selling them at 50 to clear the damn things and to hopefully get a few bucks from subscriptions

[10:30:48]

rkdavis: i was saying if someone was to purchase that hardware from whoever manufactured them. zipitwireless made a huge mistake with that device. it should not have been a tween messenger.

[10:31:25]

the problem they had was that they were 6 months too late to market and american parents are idiots :)

[10:31:33]

letting their kids have cellphones

[10:31:47]

there was never a market for it imo.

[10:31:49]

i didn't let my kid have his own phone until he was 18

[10:32:18]

but when they finally hit the market kids were being given cellphones that had messaging on them

[10:32:53]

they were a frqction too late and their priceing was a bit off

[10:33:23]

if it had comeout in 2005/6 it would have done well, 2008 was just too late

[10:33:24]

even then the functionality was so lacking when the capabilities of the device were greater than its actual use

[10:33:51]

you cannot really say that people would pay $200 for the device to use a messenger

[10:33:54]

yup but there is another consideration there, ease of use and parents

[10:34:07]

alot of the stuff in there or not in there is because of parents

[10:34:39]

imo the release time was miscalculated the price and the functionality

[10:34:54]

jagsph: not mistimed just too late

[10:35:19]

great design and functionality for 2006 but not for 2008

[10:35:34]

rkdavis: they could sell a device like this with a distro of linux and make profit. just boost the ram to 256mb, increase the screen size, and fix the layout.

[10:35:39]

and who knows where markets wil go inm the space of 2 years

[10:36:09]

jagsph: times have changed, companies move on, they are working on other stuff now

[10:36:10]

the openpandora will have a market for years to come. if this device was an openpandora they would sell them

[10:36:43]

jagsph: they are a hardware design house really, they actually have an hp branded product

[10:36:52]

rkdavis: so you have inside information? are they making an inexpensive open device?

[10:36:54]

came out late last year

[10:37:52]

:D

[10:37:56]

jagsph: i'm NDA'ed up the wazzoo but no open hardware for the time being although there is a possibility they will open up another of their products sometime soon

[10:39:10]

does this product have a url with device specs/

[10:39:18]

or does nda cover urls?

[10:39:22]

jagsph: and not really inside info but i talk to a few of them and they tell me things occasionally as i have been helping them with the forums (just became moderator)

[10:39:53]

jagsph: nope the device is available and no restriction on urls just the nly site with info doesn't have good spec info

[10:40:06]

but it's just a digital picture frame with wifi and sound

[10:40:30]

they might open it up if they get permission to do so, might not of course but it's a possibility

[10:40:33]

device for streaming mplayer videos to

[10:40:37]

bloody expensive fram etoo

[10:40:48]

yup already does youtube and the like

[10:40:56]

i would pay $15

[10:41:10]

$20 if i could attach a USB keyboard.

[10:41:28]

heh well multiply that by 5 :)

[10:41:33]

and add a few

[10:41:42]

and you might be in the ball park

[10:42:09]

Ill go buy a picture and tie a usb keyboard to it and let it dangle from the wall.

[10:42:28]

Way too much money.

[10:42:47]

yeah but zipit didn't set the price hp did

[10:43:10]

and maybe if it was 50 i might be interested but not at the price it currently is

[11:33:01]

i wonder if it's considered bad form to remove and block your wife from your facebook friends ?

[11:41:50]

<mcavity-zippy>

this thing needs an alarm clock heh

[11:43:01]

<mcavity-zippy>

8 have dumped some good quality mps on it..its handeling it nicely

[11:43:39]

<mcavity-zippy>

320 kbit

[11:44:14]

try playing some youtube

[11:45:18]

<mcavity-zippy>

havent figured that out yet

[11:46:19]

<mcavity-zippy>

but i used to have a nice video file i converted for it

[11:47:06]

<mcavity-zippy>

melody gardot..sounds good. [using real speakers]

[11:54:18]

<mcavity-zippy>

joy fun repartioning hard drives.

[11:56:11]

mcavity: dpkg -i http://ftp.us.debian.org/debian/pool/main/y/youtube-dl/youtube-dl_2010.01.19-1_all.deb ; mplayer `youtube-dl -g http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_bISJ2zi1zQ`

[11:56:34]

actually i think you need to wget. i dont think dpkg can handle urls

[11:56:42]

<mcavity-zippy>

heh

[11:56:59]

<mcavity-zippy>

when i can tlnet in i will try it

[11:57:10]

<mcavity-zippy>

ssh in

[11:58:34]

<mcavity-zippy>

for now it is time to sleep

[14:21:32]

ok i want an iPad

[14:21:41]

<Gnuet>

me3 :D

[14:21:45]

i wonder how many soda bottles and cans that is

[14:21:52]

<Gnuet>

^^

[14:22:00]

<Gnuet>

but i do need a refreshed MBP.

[14:22:29]

the prices is actually damn fair and the data plan is very reasonable even if it is at&T

[14:22:59]

<Gnuet>

do need the wifi-modell.

[14:23:21]

i was lusting after the itouch 64gig but now i can lust after the ipad 64gig

[14:23:46]

especially when you combine it with the airstash which solved one of the things i always thought was missing from the itouch/phone

[14:23:49]

no sd card slot

[14:24:18]

shipping in 60days for the wifi model and 90days for the wifi+3g models

[14:24:27]

<Gnuet>

iPad wifi + tether + iPhone 3GS should be good.

[14:26:39]

yup still no camera in it though, that was the last thing wrong with the itouch for me i don't like the iphone because of it's dataplan, too expensive for me for what i'd need/want

[14:27:12]

hi everyone

[14:27:12]

but i definatly want, i'll have to start saving and see what i can sell to suckers to raise the cash

[14:27:53]

jagsph you on?

[14:28:03]

how you doing today rkdavis?

[14:29:04]

Barranco: drooling over the iPad

[14:29:20]

lol

[14:30:00]

i wonder if it has a droll protector on it

drool protector even

hey

sup guys

yo Ampix0

hi ampix

hey rkdavis I bought my zipit this morning. it will be here the 29th

[14:36:45]

welcome to the zipit world :-P

[14:37:06]

besure to get jagsph userland - its freaken sweet

[14:37:08]

bought an 8gig SD micro w/ mini adapter last night for $18.00 on ebay

[14:37:18]

o cool

[14:37:19]

still need a card reader

[14:37:38]

ya i saw his usernand site

[14:37:47]

that the only distro with a desktop so far?

[14:38:05]

not sure - but it offers alot of good apps

[14:38:21]

oh cool

[14:38:26]

<Gnuet>

only dist with dekstop oob.

[14:38:35]

rkdavis have you installed jagsph userland - or your not going into debian again :-P

[14:38:44]

<Gnuet>

and tht reminds me, have to buy a new cardreader too ^^

[14:38:45]

and i can still install any .deb app right? like aircrack

[14:38:49]

airmon*

[14:39:00]

ampix most apps do work

[14:39:04]

OH HELL YES

[14:39:07]

CHECK THIS OUT

[14:39:08]

Mini USB 2.0 MICRO SD SDHC TF CARD READER 2GB 8GB 16GB

[14:39:08]

Mini USB 2.0 MICRO SD SDHC TF CARD READER 2GB 8GB 16GB

Sale price: $1.04

nice

Ebay ftw

free shipping

how much u paid for your zip it

[14:39:33]

that was 49.99 sadly

[14:39:43]

o - not too bad i paid $75 for mine

0.o

wtf

why

1 day shipping lol

i couldnt wait 4-5 days to get it

[14:40:11]

lol so i obught 1 day shipping - $25 extra

[14:40:37]

damn dude

[14:40:41]

yea..

[14:40:45]

Im 16 and no job XD i can do that

[14:40:53]

lol

[14:40:54]

im 21

[14:41:00]

though i did get free 2day shipping XD I did the amazon prime trial

[14:41:08]

and canceled it as soon as i bought the zipit

[14:41:09]

o nice

[14:41:13]

lmao

[14:41:31]

Ya i need to make some new youtube vids so i was like.. shit i gotta do something good

[14:41:40]

so im going to learn my way around the zipit

[14:41:52]

you know linux though ampix?

[14:42:03]

like the commands and stuff?

[14:42:16]

umm well sorta

[14:42:24]

I had ubuntu for .. a little while

[14:42:36]

well i dont think you need to know them that much if you install jagsph userland

[14:42:45]

and im kinda stuck in.. i forget the type of linux but w/e backtrack runs on

[14:42:46]

so

[14:42:49]

not debian

[14:43:17]

the thing is with the zip it - its kinda slow - and the mouse to control it is werid lol

[14:43:33]

but its a good $50 subnotebook haha

[14:43:33]

on a small machine like a zipit i would probebly rather go command line but w/e ill try userland

[14:43:41]

<Gnuet>

buuut, it's the best server-status-checkar-thinamajiggy :D

[14:43:48]

yea lol

[14:43:56]

I'll probebly use it as like

[14:43:58]

an irc machine

[14:44:00]

lol

[14:44:10]

yea it already has the irc app

[14:44:15]

in that userland

[14:44:26]

sweet

[14:44:42]

wish i programmed C so i could help the community a bit.

[14:44:50]

lol in the nes emulator that have a KKK super mario brothers 2 hack lmao

[14:44:55]

I am a not so great vb.net programmer

[14:45:20]

ah - yea i wished debian had a basic compiler

[14:45:40]

lol well then they would call it windows

[14:45:42]

XD

[14:45:47]

not really

[14:46:04]

plus i don't know vb6 or anything i code on the framework

[14:46:06]

basic is everywhere - on all types of devices

oh

ah o.k

you mean

REAL BASIC

actual basic

any basic lol

brb

k

wow thats low ram in a zipit lol

[14:48:02]

any chance of instructions for hardware mods? lol

[14:48:44]

back - theres really no hardware mods yet

[14:49:09]

just for a microphone - but i dunno where the page is for that

[14:49:49]

what is the "RS232 Serial Port" for?

[14:49:51]

all i want is mini usb support for the zip it

[14:49:58]

nothing yet

[14:50:04]

usb would be nice. but it needs more ram

[14:50:13]

sow ait this thing has a RS232 Serial Port for no reason?

[14:50:17]

so wait*

[14:50:37]

if someone hacks a usb port into it - imagen writing code for microchips on the zip it *drool*

[14:50:42]

nothing yet

[14:51:35]

what do you mean code for microchips?

[14:51:39]

because debian has a microchip compiler - all we need is usb - and we wont really need a real laptop for pic microchips - that be so cool

[14:51:44]

microcontrollers

[14:52:05]

there like mini brains lol

[14:52:18]

go on google and look up pic microchip

[14:52:31]

microcontrollers are used for everything

[14:53:02]

interesting.. so what would you write for this

[14:53:17]

i wanted to make a text based handheld game system

[14:53:45]

:P

[14:53:51]

lol yea...

[14:53:52]

I want to buy a Nintendo DS

[14:54:04]

they have some hacks for homebrew games now

[14:54:10]

make them run unsigned code

they been had hacks

for homebrew games*

oh

dsgamemaker.com

hack5 is behind the game XD

[14:54:33]

look at that

[14:54:45]

dsgamemaker is really cool

[14:54:46]

ya well im not gunna be able to buy one any time soon so f it lol

[14:54:51]

lol k

[14:55:45]

lol debian has a nintendo ds emlulator

[14:56:06]

but wont work on the zip it - and if it does run - lmao the games would be 1 frame a minute lol

[14:56:47]

XD ya

[14:56:56]

the NES emulater didnt look horrible

[14:57:20]

nes is older system - so it doesnt require much memory

[14:57:24]

right

[14:57:29]

but its fine by me

[14:57:36]

XD i love classic mario

[14:57:47]

the userland also has gb and scumm vm emulators

[14:58:11]

o yea - the zip it can be used to play gba games - but they run slow too

[14:58:36]

according to davishunter - it runs only 10% the speed of gba

scumm vm?

google it lol

brb

k brb for me too

<Gnuet>

beneath a steel sky is _THE_ best scummvm-adventure. evar.

im back guys

back

im back too

scummvm looks horrible XD

[15:07:02]

I might just sell this thing hacked on ebay

[15:07:11]

after i get a chance with it XD

[15:07:35]

ampix - did you know that have portable routers which you can plug in cell phone sim cards into it to get wifi lol - i found that out not to long ago - so you can like go anywhere with a zip it and always have internet :-P

[15:07:42]

lol

[15:08:32]

that would be great

[15:08:39]

lol awesome but i dont have a cellphone data plan

[15:08:46]

is there any good use for teh expansion port on the back of the zipit

[15:08:53]

and if i did i would just go on the internet there..

[15:09:02]

lol ampix0 our nicks look alike

[15:09:09]

me sorta

[15:09:12]

meh*

[15:09:27]

adnyx - theres nothing for the port yet

[15:09:49]

yano theres a wired remote port next to the headphone jack

[15:09:57]

i keep wanting to plug a mouse in there

[15:10:02]

lol

[15:10:12]

yea lol

[15:10:31]

adny - have you gotten the jagsph's userland yet?

yes i have

it works well

yea

and looks nice

yea lol - i really like it

[15:11:36]

and is usable enough that people at my school that want web on their zipit

[15:11:49]

but are used to apple-like simpleness could use it

[15:12:00]

ive had a few people ask me to flash their zipits

[15:12:17]

lol its so easy to flash

[15:12:17]

well i mean, the ask me if i can "put facebook" on their zipits

[15:12:25]

yea

[15:12:30]

if you have basic computer skills

[15:13:03]

put facebook on there zipit lol - just flash it for them (even for a fee) and then they can use the links web browser

[15:13:28]

facebook should work i think

[15:13:39]

except for flash applications

[15:13:57]

but login and check messages ect.. should work

[15:14:50]

yep

[15:15:02]

course they dont tend to have mini sd cards

[15:15:08]

so id have to charge for those

im not loded

yea

how old are you?

14

if you dont mind me asking?

[15:15:35]

o o.k

[15:15:52]

idk why i would mind you asking

[15:16:21]

i dunno - just some people are like "none of your business" lol

[15:16:24]

anyways

[15:16:32]

im 21 years old

[15:16:32]

about that port for the remote

[15:16:36]

ah

[15:16:45]

i have no clue about the ports

[15:16:50]

do you think it would be possible to modify a mouse to work in it

[15:17:05]

the one next to the headphone jack?

[15:17:09]

its got four metal parts (lol idk what to call them)

yes

same as usb

no its not

i doubt it could be used for a mouse

[15:17:35]

well not the same shape

[15:17:47]

i think a mouse port has like 7 pins

[15:17:53]

im just dreamin here, dont kill it

[15:17:54]

lol

[15:18:02]

lol sorry :-P

[15:18:14]

zipit with a mouse would be epic

[15:18:23]

the first zipit - had a hack to put a mini usb port in it

[15:18:37]

but no one gotten it to work on the z2 :-(

[15:18:55]

if we could get a mini usb or regular usb port - then a mouse would be possable

[15:19:06]

ah

[15:19:14]

well what about the back expansion port

[15:19:25]

has anyone identifyed the pinouts?

[15:19:26]

dunno

[15:19:34]

i dont know - they might have

[15:20:06]

give me a minute - i'll see if anyone has

[15:24:03]

yes they posted on the zipit wiki

[15:24:15]

but you need to register to see them

[15:24:32]

i believe im registered

[15:24:44]

who operates that website by the way

[15:25:04]

yea im registered

[15:25:06]

linux.zipitwiewless.com is zipit themselves

[15:25:12]

wow

[15:25:17]

so they support the hacking?

[15:25:39]

yes within reason

[15:25:43]

rkdavis - has anyone been able to make a mini usb hack on the zipit

[15:26:06]

what are some other useful websites ( i know hunterdavis's blog

[15:26:10]

Barranco: only client only -- the usb host pins on the cpu aren't broughtout to the mb

[15:26:26]

Adnyxo: openzipit.sourceforge.net

[15:26:26]

so youd have to solder directly to the cpu?

[15:26:41]

ah o.k

[15:26:44]

http://zipit2system.sourceforge.net/

[15:27:06]

how did they get a usb mini port on the z1?

[15:27:15]

Adnyxo: the pins would probably mean unsoldering the cpu so it's a very advanced process

[15:27:28]

okay forget that

[15:28:03]

rkdavis - what about the port by the headphones - what is that for?

[15:28:05]

the pins are near the edge of the processor so there is a possible way to get to it but very fiddily and probably not reliable if you even could

[15:28:05]

http://zipit2system.sourceforge.net/?page_id=21 hey are people actually working on this? cause if so, awesome

[15:28:15]

that's the mic socket

[15:28:24]

ahh o.k

[15:28:24]

but noone has yet found the right connector

[15:28:38]

it looks like the nintendo headet but it doesn't work

[15:28:46]

lol they put ports on theyre device but nothing to plug in

[15:29:05]

Adnyxo: it probably existed when it was designed

[15:29:12]

theyre trying to add a gsm module??

[15:29:29]

Adnyxo: ?????

[15:29:40]

adnyx - i doubt that since they have wifi on the device

[15:30:11]

Attach GSM module to I2c to UART chip (Datasheet)

[15:30:16]

quote from the website

[15:30:24]

o wow

[15:30:41]

Attach accelerometer to expansion port (Datasheet)

[15:30:41]

Attach 1.3 megapixel camera (Datasheet)

[15:30:41]

Attach I2c to UART chip for GSM module (Datasheet)

[15:30:41]

Attach GSM module to I2c to UART chip (Datasheet)

[15:30:47]

that would be quite epic

[15:31:02]

anyways i gtg

[15:31:13]

Adnyxo: where did you see the gsm thing?

[15:36:21]

click goals

[15:36:27]

go down to hardware

[15:42:11]

http://zipit2system.sourceforge.net/?page_id=21

[16:11:56]

<dTal>

Hiya folks

[16:12:04]

<dTal>

any word on USB host?

[16:12:51]

<dTal>

I looked at the pins on my own Zipit, it's going to be impossible to access them properly

[16:13:15]

<dTal>

but there are a lot of pads on the circuit board, they might have brought them out just for the hell of it

[16:13:43]

<dTal>

has anyone tried loading the usb driver and simply probing the pads?

[16:14:25]

<dTal>

(also, I note that some of the padshave indentations on them, as if they were used in the factory - any clue why?)

[16:30:31]

<dTal>

Also, how come Zipit don't just tell us?

[16:35:14]

dTal: because the usb host pins aren't connected so there is nothing to tell us maybe?

[16:35:39]

<dTal>

Then they could say so. But they're remarkably reticent about hardware information.

[16:36:03]

<dTal>

At least for a company that likes to portray itself as hacker-friendly.

[16:36:28]

<dTal>

I mean, I'd at least like to know what all those pads do.

[16:37:19]

well what do you need to know? they confirmed that the serial and jtag pads are where they are

[16:37:50]

and being hacker friendly doesn't mean they have to tell us anything just that they don't care if we work it out

[16:38:29]

<dTal>

Hmm. A remarkably permissive definition of "friendly" you've got there.

[16:38:31]

do apple tell you what everything is?

[16:38:48]

<dTal>

Most companies don't care, or if they do they can't do anything about it.

[16:39:13]

<dTal>

Apple deliberately hinders open source development with its open source Darwin. I hate them.

[16:39:50]

<dTal>

I'd just like to know what all the pads do. Someone somewhere knows, and probably even has a pdf with them all nicely labeled.

[16:40:00]

most of the unused pads are probably test pads anyway, if there had been a usb host to be had someone would have found it by now

[16:40:07]

<dTal>

After all, someone had to design the board.

[16:40:29]

dTal: and they did /seed/ the knowledge originally, take a look at the early irc logs

[16:40:32]

<dTal>

What's the usual procedure for finding pads?

[16:41:03]

dTal: probably best to ask a hardware guy there maybe foxx or gpsfan

[16:41:48]

and it obviously isn't easy as lokichaos did promise in septemeber that someone was looking at it and we never heard back other than next week and that was 3 months ago :)

[16:42:13]

but i presume it's put a known value in and look to see where it comes out

[16:42:23]

and/or very good eyesight

[16:42:25]

<dTal>

Mmm. Like I said, soldering directly to the chip is not viable.

[16:42:55]

dTal: well there is a technique that could do it i saw on hackaday but looks very fiddily and not reliable

[16:43:09]

but the pins on the cpu are actually very close to the edge

[16:43:20]

looks like outer two rows

[16:43:32]

<dTal>

The edge in question is obscured by some other components.

[16:43:44]

top right (or left depending on how you look at it )

[16:43:45]

<dTal>

Also the die has an overhang.

[16:44:23]

<dTal>

I've got my Zipit open in front of me, and if someone soldered that and didn't destroy anything, I'd be happy to call them superhuman.

[16:44:33]

yup but if you want it enough you could do it

[16:44:40]

you just don't want it enough :)

[16:45:27]

<dTal>

Oh, it's not that, just that I don't want it so badly I'm willing to risk destroying my Zipit. Which isn't really a risk but a certainty.

[16:47:13]

<dTal>

You couldn't even bring a soldering iron to bear on it. Someting thin enough to fit under the overhang would inevitably lose too much heat that it either wouldn't melt the solder, or would melt the chip around it.

[16:50:21]

<dTal>

It's possible, for instance, that they've brought out the SDIO pinouts to pads. That would enable USB as well, with a bit more work.

[16:50:34]

<dTal>

*GPIO

[16:51:55]

well the sdio is probably already available just need drivers

[16:52:13]

as an sd slot and sdio slot are electrically the same (more or less)

[16:52:34]

it's really just drivers and possibly a patch wire at most

[16:53:17]

the chip does it but it might not be quite so simple but it might be

[16:53:29]

<dTal>

Well, if you did use SDIO, you'd preclude the use of the SD card wouldn't you?

[16:53:50]

<dTal>

They've surely made use of the onboard SD controller

[16:54:10]

well you can get sdio cards with flash in them too

[16:54:17]

although most are fullsize

[16:54:23]

<dTal>

But there is GPIO.

[16:54:45]

<dTal>

Which, if on pads, could be configured to act as USB.

[16:54:59]

but again sd cards are electriacally the same so if there was room you could make a fullsize holder in there

[16:55:44]

we have usb client and wouldn't the gpio only work as client too? not hist

[16:56:00]

<dTal>

No, it's general purpose

[16:56:21]

i;m not a hardware guy so i don't know (not a software guy either for that matter :) )

[16:56:49]

yes but no host controller on the end of the gpio so you'd have to do alot to /emulate it/

[16:57:45]

<dTal>

correct

[16:57:48]

<dTal>

but it would work!

[16:58:07]

<dTal>

and I haven't checked, but I'm certain the code has already been written

[16:59:55]

<dTal>

alternatively, just put in a USB host controller

[17:01:53]

or find another board that fits in the case and has the same connectors and force it in

[17:21:30]

<dTal>

A bit of googling shows that this indeed possible and has been done.

[17:21:41]

<dTal>

(gpio to usb)

[17:21:51]

<dTal>

A module for 2.6 kernel exists.

[17:22:05]

<dTal>

All we really need now are some spare gpio pads.

[17:22:18]

k

[17:22:31]

well have at it with your probe

[17:22:52]

or wait until foxx or gpsfan or one of the other hardware guru's appears

[17:23:03]

and then we'll bug them together

[17:23:47]

<dTal>

Hmm, wait, I could be wrong

[17:23:55]

<dTal>

I misinterpreted something

[17:23:57]

<dTal>

hang on

[17:26:12]

im back

[17:26:36]

hi dTal - hope you find a way to get usb working on the bad boy zipit

[17:26:48]

i would love to get usb working too

[17:27:02]

imagen being able to program microchips on the zip it!

[17:28:02]

rkdavis have you used jagsph userland yet?

[17:28:37]

<dTal>

okay the GPIO lines switch at 10 mhz

[17:28:44]

<dTal>

(or slower)

[17:28:53]

Barranco: no i don't have a zipit capable of running it atm

[17:29:00]

o o.k

[17:29:08]

i also made a case mod for the zip it

[17:29:29]

Barranco: i have to pull my finger out and meet up with foxx as he is gong to do the serial mod for me on my bricked zipit

[17:29:49]

its has 2 newport packs on the case - lol looks soo funny - and has a cig holder lol

[17:29:54]

ah o.k rkdavis

[17:29:55]

<dTal>

so 12 mbps is impossible

[17:30:02]

<dTal>

but 1.1 should be

[17:30:11]

<dTal>

flash drives will excruciatingly slow

[17:30:15]

<dTal>

but mice will work

[17:30:28]

<dTal>

at least it won't be a major processor drain

[17:34:26]

yup

[17:34:52]

even th eability to use usb peripherals would be handy

[17:35:33]

i'm still waiting to be able to get an airstash as that will solve storage probelems so no usb drive would be needed

[17:39:56]

<dTal>

night

[17:42:13]

I dont need the apple ipad

[17:42:19]

i dont want it

[17:42:35]

its a lock on every aspect of your media

[17:42:42]

from small (ipod)

[17:42:51]

to huge (iMac)

[17:42:55]

this fills the last gap

[17:43:06]

so they can completly control your digital life

[17:46:08]

just a short rant

[17:47:03]

i hate apple and their artsy fartsy dwsigner overpriced crap but it looks like somehing i wanted since the 80s

[17:47:16]

and the 3g data plans are reasonably priced

[17:48:16]

and apart from lack of camera and sd card slot it's what i could suse and the sd card thing is mitigatable

[17:53:21]

but i cant figure out what you need this for

[17:53:32]

if you have a laptop

[17:53:46]

and a tv and a phone like most peopple

[17:54:13]

plus, my whole desktop costed only $350

[17:54:40]

so unless i really need this for something im not gonna pay $499, even though that is a big drop from apples usual pricing

[17:57:07]

also if you do want that netbooks are cheaper and have a keyboard

[17:59:32]

also, its not really their new creation http://www.archos.com/products/imt/archos_5it/index.html?country=dk&lang=en

[17:59:39]

and there are many others

[18:00:38]

SOMEONE LISTEN TO ME

[18:00:52]

sorry, im pissed and arguing with an apple fangirl

[18:26:50]

jagsph

[18:27:28]

since your image is a pre-release, do you have a timeline for added features? also, are you accepting feature/.program requests?

[18:32:08]

also, what kind of conversion is required for video in mplayer

[18:38:36]

Adnyxo: It was said the other day mplayer will play anything as long as the codecs are present. Unfortunately, VLC, which is codec agnostic, is said not to work yet.

[18:43:47]

I'm trying to load the GUI keymap with "xmodmap /etc/keymap.map" I get back "xmodmap: unable to open display ' ' ". What do I need to put in for the -display arguement of xmodmap?

hey guys

hey rkdavis

hey armpix

hey Adnyxo

didnt see you there :P

[18:57:09]

you seen the apple ipad

[18:57:19]

LOL i was just looking at it on LTA

[18:57:32]

i dont really think it is needed

[18:57:47]

Im not a fan of apple AT ALL, however I know that without apple.. i probebly wouldnt be typing to you on a laptop

[18:57:55]

love/hate relationship

[18:57:55]

what?

[18:57:57]

i see

[18:58:10]

well apple is responcible for home computers

[18:58:41]

i guess so

[18:58:52]

well.. steve wozniak (spelled wrong) and john draper

[18:59:05]

but do you think they would never have happened without apple, or just happened later

[18:59:17]

well

[18:59:21]

MUCH later

[18:59:35]

and we wouldnt have any of the tech we have today because of that

[18:59:52]

the ipad seems to be one of their least innovative inventions

[18:59:55]

I will never buy a mac computer but, I do respect what they have done

[19:00:00]

the ipod was a new thing and so was the iphone

[19:00:08]

The ipad is absolutely nothing special -.-

[19:00:15]

but there have been tablets forever, like the archos fice

[19:00:17]

five

[19:00:24]

OLED rocks my world :D *drools*

[19:00:42]

so why area ll the iFanbois flipping out like its a revolutionary idea?

[19:00:47]

oled is awesome

[19:01:06]

im sick of hearing "apple has revamped and updated the computing industry again"

[19:01:24]

um

[19:01:25]

ITS JUST A F###### tablet

[19:01:31]

okay sorry im kinda pissed

[19:01:32]

thats what the deal with apple fans is

[19:01:37]

they feel like part of a cult

[19:01:41]

true

[19:01:42]

that is better than everyone

[19:01:50]

they refuse to listen to anything

[19:01:51]

sadly the same is true about linux

[19:02:00]

BUT those people are smart

[19:02:04]

for the most part

[19:02:11]

nothing at all is wrong with apple or its products

[19:02:15]

they dont listen to reason

[19:03:37]

well I don't like their products for many reasons but i wont go into that -.-

[19:03:45]

I do lve my ipod touch though :P

go on

plus we need apple

ill listen

apple products are sometimes nice

[19:04:09]

just pricey and locked in

[19:04:16]

but its the cult that i really hate

[19:04:30]

They do prudice newish tech which forces other companies to produce it on the cheap :P

[19:04:41]

i mean the people that will buy shit in an aluminum case if steve jobs says to

[19:04:48]

ya

[19:04:50]

they will

[19:05:01]

but apple likes to think they are cutting edge

[19:05:04]

which they are not

[19:05:06]

BUT

[19:05:14]

like i said, archos 5 is like old

[19:05:19]

BUT what?

[19:05:22]

They actually put the new shit on the market even though its still expensive

[19:05:30]

true

[19:05:34]

SOO what does that do

[19:05:43]

lowsers it everywhere else

[19:05:56]

Apple does essentially move us through tech faster

[19:06:01]

ill give them that

[19:06:13]

even though i dont wan't there shitty OS based on FREEBSD

[19:06:21]

their*

[19:06:51]

though they have dropped prices a decent amount. Now im just to much of a windows fan XD

[19:07:04]

Love to hack :P need windows for it

[19:07:29]

i was surprised at the $499

[19:08:03]

i was too

[19:08:11]

though i know its still way to expensive

[19:08:20]

i am proud they kept it low XD

[19:09:13]

though its a scheme to get as many people as possible to buy it (and attempt to buy windows users)

[19:09:51]

also, they want to sell itunes media

[19:10:19]

ah nice..

[19:10:28]

your in highschool?

[19:10:32]

dont you have midterms then?

yes

freshman

pretty much

(i am too)

well im a jr

16?

lol ya 16

hey how much do you think a hacked zipit would go for on ebay?

[19:12:16]

running userland

[19:13:31]

idk perhaps $70

[19:13:49]

you can alway start bidding at $60 and see

[19:14:04]

i may sell mine and get a new one if i get a good enough price

[19:14:05]

hmm

[19:14:10]

it could become a business

[19:14:23]

i believe rkdavis is an authorized zipit retailer though

[19:14:23]

and i wouldnt need to send off the SD card with them right?

[19:14:27]

yes

[19:14:47]

so i could put userland on the zipit sell it on ebay and buy another for $50

[19:14:49]

not bad

[19:15:23]

if i had extra time, id do that

[19:17:34]

i dont have a job or anyhting lol

[19:18:36]

i need money to buy more shit to hack for youtube lol

[19:18:55]

I actually only bought this zipit thing for youtube XD i dont really want it.

[19:19:10]

well

[19:19:12]

i kinda want one

[19:20:25]

bought it to watch youtube videos? or make them

[19:26:03]

ludacris! i love my zipit

[19:28:52]

whoops

[19:28:58]

sorry forgot about the chat

[19:28:59]

XD

[19:29:07]

I bought it to make a few youtube videos

[19:29:34]

im starving. I'll ttyl. bye guys

[19:36:28]

bye

[19:36:35]

i love my zipit too

[19:36:42]

but i dont know why i need it

[19:36:47]

other than email

[22:52:03]

<jagsph_>

snes9x now working on the z2.

[22:52:27]

:)

[23:00:14]

jagsph: I'm trying to load the GUI keymap with "xmodmap /etc/keymap.map" I get back "xmodmap: unable to open display ' ' ". What do I need to put in for the -display arguement of xmodmap?

[23:08:32]

<jagsph_>

try as a regular user, make sure you are starting or in xorg to use xmodmap

[23:08:35]

<jagsph_>

i have to go bbl

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